this was posted before, it’s a 5000 person survey by a non-profit for “finding the intersection of religion in society for clergy and the public” (hence the weird religious breakdown), which they got by just emailing people on a USPS list with a few hundred self-selected opt-ins on top. Which also inherently excludes a bunch of people, like those who’ve moved a lot or recently, any and all homeless, lumpenized people and people in distant or ad-hoc or delapidated communities with vague USPS lines and addresses, those who don’t have internet access, those in prisons, and those who don’t check their email, and those who wouldn’t be arsed with these kinds of surveys by religion-in-politics non-profits, and countless other groups. Inherently. The study also has no breakdowns for class or income, if they live in rural, urban, or suburban environs, or even generation breakdowns for most of the questions including this one (but does for some others, weirdly); and the 18-29 age group is vanishingly small compared to the others; and just a bunch of god awful things. Which is shocking to be taken at face value, this trash 5000 person “christian nationalism” survey as “percent of Americans” like the survey says. And then you get such god awful trash takes like in this thread of “if only I’d organized harder” absolutely anti-marxist nonsense, nihilist trash.
That comment pissed me off, the whole trend of doomerist opportunism too. this site is so often just a black hole that no one is interested in fighting against and I’m fucking myself up wasting my time trying in the tide of it. It’s an active negation of revolutionary consciousness in an environment which needs it cultivated and brought into the real material world. So many people seem near universally more interested in uncritical and angry insular bias-spirals and opportunist defeatism, opportunist self-confirmation of ‘nothing to be done’ and ‘might as well flee’ (which shows a petty-bourgeois affordance), and the worst: opportunism-masquerading-as-principle then shit out onto others in a misery-loves-company kind of way, than anything else constructive. Just straight-line-segment-from-the-curve understandings, as fuel for undialectical projections of doomsaying, so do-nothing opportunists can say “SEE?!?!?!” at whatever they think gives them the opportunity and get applause from other do-nothings, which facilitates the furthering the comparative growth of reaction more than the reactionaries are capable of facilitating themselves than if people were interested in constructive active forward-moving analysis of things.
Socialists in the real world (which are exponentially growing in number every month and have been for almost a decade) I’ve worked with don’t talk like people here, by and large engage more healthily about problems in society, and are more interested in engaging critically along lines of where the problems are and aren’t in given things, and working the angles to separate them along dividing lines. This site is 75+% online ultra-leftism wearing the mask of something else. There are people who have been being tortured in US prisons for decades for their activism who have more revolutionary spirit, optimism, fluidity, criticality, and desire for and KNOWLEDGE OF whole-inclusive revolutionary change, and active political consciousness and preparedness to fight by it than the metaphysical one-sided self-satisfied petty-bourgeois-oriented shit I see here.
“iF oNlY i HaD oRgAniZeD mOrE~” People who say this shit are do-nothings. People who support and further it are do-nothings, thinking the people who turned out in the Floyd uprisings, the ever-growing militant labor and tenant movements, and even students occupying colleges at the cost of their petty bourgeois futures over Palestine (A THING WHICH DOESN’T DIRECTLY EFFECT THEM, compared to Vietnam protests where they were being DRAFTED — a MARK OF ELEVATED CONSCIOUSNESS) are nothing compared to these 5000 home-owners (or otherwise long-term tenants) who decide to partake in a shitty religious email survey? Because, and not just from this, that’s what I get and what I hear, more than I get or hear anything else on this site. I wonder, where have these people been this past 10 years, if they have not been on the street seeing what I’ve seen in just my small part of it? They seem to be seeing less than comrades writing from inside prison walls somehow.
Yes the US, particularly in its bourgeois and petty bourgeois, is largely reactionary, we know this (without this trash ‘American Academy of Religion’ member survey which should be thrown in the trash); particularly in the ongoing historical inheritance of colonial relations, and that this is an avenue where false-consciousness gets pushed when alternatives are not posited and constructed due to these historical relations and its inherited contradictions. But Christ. I’ve seen more things and comments on this site, whose only purpose and only constructed framing is to uncritically reinforce insular and doomsaying biases as dead-end metaphysical ‘truths’, to spiral people into do-nothing emptiness and defeatism before any battle has even been fought by ANY of the people saying these things; than I’ve seen constructive forward-moving dialectical considerations. I’ve seen more attempts by do-nothings to self-indulgently self-satisfyingly panic-monger and doomsay about their imagined reality “out there” where they do not stand or in some dreamed-up future, to inflame destructive and opportunist impulses in people to make more do-nothings (or worse), than positive construction toward anything — or even serious Marxist criticality toward circumstances or material put forward, as long as it confirms OPPORTUNIST, ULTRA-LEFT BIASES and helps people feel like their do-nothingism is somehow ‘principled analysis’ and they can feel self-satisfied in saying so. Which is effectively reactionary, discouraging socialists of the possibility and reality of change being built, and passing it off as ‘principled analysis’ based on one’s own shallow and actively-sought bias-confirmation as a metaphysical truth, rather than developing working and critical dialectical consideration in one’s analysis of material circumstances and events, their internal components, and relations to other circumstances and events as a whole living reality and unfolding history in which we are all partaking in in the ways we do.
The flight of some people from the underground could have been the result of their fatigue and dispiritedness. Such individuals may only be pitied; they should be helped because their dispiritedness will pass and there will again appear an urge to get away from philistinism, away from the liberals and the liberal-labour policy, to the working-class underground. But when the fatigued and dispirited use journalism as their platform and announce that their flight is not a manifestation of fatigue, or weakness, or intellectual woolliness, but that it is to their credit, and then put the blame on the “ineffective,” “worthless,” “moribund,” etc., underground, these runaways then become disgusting renegades, apostates. These runaways then become the worst advisers for the working-class movement and therefore its dangerous enemies.
I very much agree with the sentiment, and have been considering my own effortposting about it. The doomerism here is unbearable at times, and content is frequently actually warped just to seem worse than it is for the sake of having something to be angry at. Even when I make positive posts the top comment will immediately “but actually it’s bad because X”.
this was posted before, it’s a 5000 person survey by a non-profit for “finding the intersection of religion in society for clergy and the public” (hence the weird religious breakdown), which they got by just emailing people on a USPS list with a few hundred self-selected opt-ins on top. Which also inherently excludes a bunch of people, like those who’ve moved a lot or recently, any and all homeless, lumpenized people and people in distant or ad-hoc or delapidated communities with vague USPS lines and addresses, those who don’t have internet access, those in prisons, and those who don’t check their email, and those who wouldn’t be arsed with these kinds of surveys by religion-in-politics non-profits, and countless other groups. Inherently. The study also has no breakdowns for class or income, if they live in rural, urban, or suburban environs, or even generation breakdowns for most of the questions including this one (but does for some others, weirdly); and the 18-29 age group is vanishingly small compared to the others; and just a bunch of god awful things. Which is shocking to be taken at face value, this trash 5000 person “christian nationalism” survey as “percent of Americans” like the survey says. And then you get such god awful trash takes like in this thread of “if only I’d organized harder” absolutely anti-marxist nonsense, nihilist trash.
That comment pissed me off, the whole trend of doomerist opportunism too. this site is so often just a black hole that no one is interested in fighting against and I’m fucking myself up wasting my time trying in the tide of it. It’s an active negation of revolutionary consciousness in an environment which needs it cultivated and brought into the real material world. So many people seem near universally more interested in uncritical and angry insular bias-spirals and opportunist defeatism, opportunist self-confirmation of ‘nothing to be done’ and ‘might as well flee’ (which shows a petty-bourgeois affordance), and the worst: opportunism-masquerading-as-principle then shit out onto others in a misery-loves-company kind of way, than anything else constructive. Just straight-line-segment-from-the-curve understandings, as fuel for undialectical projections of doomsaying, so do-nothing opportunists can say “SEE?!?!?!” at whatever they think gives them the opportunity and get applause from other do-nothings, which facilitates the furthering the comparative growth of reaction more than the reactionaries are capable of facilitating themselves than if people were interested in constructive active forward-moving analysis of things.
Socialists in the real world (which are exponentially growing in number every month and have been for almost a decade) I’ve worked with don’t talk like people here, by and large engage more healthily about problems in society, and are more interested in engaging critically along lines of where the problems are and aren’t in given things, and working the angles to separate them along dividing lines. This site is 75+% online ultra-leftism wearing the mask of something else. There are people who have been being tortured in US prisons for decades for their activism who have more revolutionary spirit, optimism, fluidity, criticality, and desire for and KNOWLEDGE OF whole-inclusive revolutionary change, and active political consciousness and preparedness to fight by it than the metaphysical one-sided self-satisfied petty-bourgeois-oriented shit I see here.
“iF oNlY i HaD oRgAniZeD mOrE~” People who say this shit are do-nothings. People who support and further it are do-nothings, thinking the people who turned out in the Floyd uprisings, the ever-growing militant labor and tenant movements, and even students occupying colleges at the cost of their petty bourgeois futures over Palestine (A THING WHICH DOESN’T DIRECTLY EFFECT THEM, compared to Vietnam protests where they were being DRAFTED — a MARK OF ELEVATED CONSCIOUSNESS) are nothing compared to these 5000 home-owners (or otherwise long-term tenants) who decide to partake in a shitty religious email survey? Because, and not just from this, that’s what I get and what I hear, more than I get or hear anything else on this site. I wonder, where have these people been this past 10 years, if they have not been on the street seeing what I’ve seen in just my small part of it? They seem to be seeing less than comrades writing from inside prison walls somehow.
Yes the US, particularly in its bourgeois and petty bourgeois, is largely reactionary, we know this (without this trash ‘American Academy of Religion’ member survey which should be thrown in the trash); particularly in the ongoing historical inheritance of colonial relations, and that this is an avenue where false-consciousness gets pushed when alternatives are not posited and constructed due to these historical relations and its inherited contradictions. But Christ. I’ve seen more things and comments on this site, whose only purpose and only constructed framing is to uncritically reinforce insular and doomsaying biases as dead-end metaphysical ‘truths’, to spiral people into do-nothing emptiness and defeatism before any battle has even been fought by ANY of the people saying these things; than I’ve seen constructive forward-moving dialectical considerations. I’ve seen more attempts by do-nothings to self-indulgently self-satisfyingly panic-monger and doomsay about their imagined reality “out there” where they do not stand or in some dreamed-up future, to inflame destructive and opportunist impulses in people to make more do-nothings (or worse), than positive construction toward anything — or even serious Marxist criticality toward circumstances or material put forward, as long as it confirms OPPORTUNIST, ULTRA-LEFT BIASES and helps people feel like their do-nothingism is somehow ‘principled analysis’ and they can feel self-satisfied in saying so. Which is effectively reactionary, discouraging socialists of the possibility and reality of change being built, and passing it off as ‘principled analysis’ based on one’s own shallow and actively-sought bias-confirmation as a metaphysical truth, rather than developing working and critical dialectical consideration in one’s analysis of material circumstances and events, their internal components, and relations to other circumstances and events as a whole living reality and unfolding history in which we are all partaking in in the ways we do.
Log off and join an org
I very much agree with the sentiment, and have been considering my own effortposting about it. The doomerism here is unbearable at times, and content is frequently actually warped just to seem worse than it is for the sake of having something to be angry at. Even when I make positive posts the top comment will immediately “but actually it’s bad because X”.
it was a sarcastic comment I made, but I agree it was trash and I deleted it soon after making it.